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[ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4752: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3887) [phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4754: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3887) [phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4755: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3887) [phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/includes/functions.php on line 4756: Cannot modify header information - headers already sent by (output started at [ROOT]/includes/functions.php:3887) RS Motorsport :: Classic Speed Restored • View topic - Greenfields Mk1 Escort handling project
A few years has elapsed since I last posted to this forum. My Mk1 has been patiently waiting in the shed under blankets for its next outing. Recently I decided to sell my WRX STi and bring the Escort out to play, spending some of the proceeds of the STi sale on the old girl. The car is currently at a panel beaters getting some rust and paint work done, but I digress.
The Escort's is sitting on its standard running gear, the car is a '73 1300XL Coupe.
The car isn't daily driven, In the past I have done some track work and hill climbing on top of weekend spirited (as far as a 1300 can be spirited) driving.
My ultimate solution for the suspension would be to have some level of adjust-ability. I love to tinker with handling. As to what level of adjust-ability, thats what this post is all about. At a minimum I would like front camber and all round damping adjustment. Height adjustment would be nice to have but its not a primary requirement.
I am aware of the GAZ Coilover kits for the Mk1, on paper these seem to meet my requirements. I can't seem to find all that much information from end users. They have a kit that allows you to delete the leaf springs also that I found interesting. I have read that there are Bilstien units available for the front as well as coil over conversions for several small ford strut types.
At my disposal I have a MK2 RS2000 parts car that will happily donate it's front suspension to serve as a base for the Mk1 if a coilover conversion was a recommended way forward. Alternatively they could be left stock with some adjustable shock absorbers and some strut tops these might meet my needs, but that doesn't offer me much for the rear end.
At this stage I don't have specific budget in mind because I don't understand enough about what is involved to meet my requirements or the various price points associated with going from standard suspension to coilovers, or removing the leaf springs.
Is that enough information for you guys to make some recommendations for both front and rear suspension, with a focus on adjust-ability? If you have any experience with retailers that sell a product that you would recommend that would be excellent as well (I'm in Adelaide).
Plenty on this forum who will offer you good advice but i'll start by asking, specifically what will you be using the car for. Is it primarily a road car? and what wheels and tyres are you running?
adjustable and legal don't always go hand in hand. But for a trackday road registered car here are some suggestions best shock absorber you can afford. Gaz are good road shock absorbers and some are very happy with them on the track but I think there are better. The Bilstein GRP? is a very common conversion but none of your available struts will suit. they are a dedicated strut to suit. Koni make a few inserts that would be OK, I use Rx7 inserts on 275-330 lbs springs. They are shorter than escort or similar inserts helping with travel on a low car. If money is no issue some rave about Proflex and similar high end shocks. You could have the Koni's modified to suit. Replace all bushes with poly. Adjustable lower arms and camber adjustable strut tops are a good thing. (not sure of roadworthy issues) the common eccentric tops(lots of bolt holes) adjust camber and caster at the same time, but not individually. Might be better with sliding tops for ultimate fine tuning. Anti dive kit, and triple wide bushes and larger front swaybar are essential if keeping standard type parts. Or stiffer springs and tension or compression struts and smaller sway bar. As for height adjustable pretty cheap out of the UK but they commonly use 2 1/4 rather than 2 1/2 diameter springs that is more readily available here. However much cheaper than here and if you can wait for deliveries or buy a selection of springs all the better. (some locals make the smaller 2 1/4) Rear is either easy or real complex. Common Australian mods are reverse eyed and additional leaf, leaf springs and good shock absorbers. No sway bar is the consensus of most though some still like to try Poly bush of course. I ran adjustable shackles to no real noticeable benefit. An alternate is single leaf springs popular in the UK again. Lateral location is as easy as a panhard bar, slightly more complex with a diff housing mounted watts link and most complex with a chassis mounted watts link kit or woblinks...whatever the hell they are!. Tramp can benefit from anti tramp bars which require brackets welding to chassis and diff housing, some like them, some say they bind the suspension I liked them. Removing the leaf springs requires substantial welding of link boxes in the floor where the rear seat sits and provides 4 new longitudinal arms of about 600mm length and either rose/heim joints and or rubber/poly bushes at the ends. There may be a few kits that utilise bolt on arms rather than complex welding but I have no experience with them. then you need coil springs to suspend the rear end so turrets are required and adapted rear coilover dampers are necessary It would be very worthwhile considering a quick rack, GRP4 steering coupling and some swear on world cup cross members but I think they are good for cars likely to be airborne but not necessary for track cars. Don't forget best tyres of the right type you can afford at the right pressure photos for fun rear body boxes Clubman type
Compression struts
adjustable 2 1/4 springs on modified Bilstein stubs
2.0 Escorts have the same diameter (~51mm) strut tube as the capri and can be used. The steering arms are fixed so if you bend one it could mean scrapping the whole strut. Also, the tierod is metric taper so you'd need to put a mk2 rack in it. I'm not sure if the Capri and 2.0 struts are the same length so you might need to take more/less than 40mm out.
Plenty of good advice and options mentioned above. The only things I would add from my point of view is as follows.
It's not worth searching for second hand struts to modify. People want heaps for Capri struts these days, everything is getting rarer and they are not a cheap junkyard upgrade like in the past. By the time you find and mod them you have basically spent the same as buying a remanufactured kit from a UK supplier. Some kits are better than others, Gartrac the best but most expensive, but for anything but a rally car, all should be fine and you would notice no difference.
Further to that, that would be my preferred option with a bilstein strut, they are a very flexible shock absorber due to their design and the inverted 40mm design will offer greater handling benefits than a traditional strut. They are not adjustable though which brings me to my next belief which is that once set up right, you really shouldn't need adjustability, especially if you don't mind a rougher ride as you may find the best damping setup for outright tarmac grip is not actually that rough/uncomfortable on the road. The best adjustability would come from your springs and alignment. In which case, adjustable tops and coilovers are the go. Some may disagree and like to fiddle with damping setups, and everyone is different so I'm not saying I'm right. Just my opinion that unless your tuning for a specific purpose, or rally, your application is just not varied enough to warrant stepping out of some readily available formulas that have been tried and tested sooo many times for this purpose. Further to that, once you have the bilstein setup, down the road you can take it to someone like MCA who can rebuild the strut for you with effectively the same body/tubes but with a fancy truly performance shock internals with external canisters and adjustability, this is the ultimate solution and only really doable with the inverted strut design for the ultimate strut.
For the rear, I would not go down the route of multiple links. Once again, only really of benefit on a rally car or if you just can't help yourself. It's ALOT of work, that will snowball into other areas and cost a sh*t load by the time your done. Some of the fastest tarmac escorts in the country that have won hillclimb and improved production championships use no more than well tuned leaf springs (kings springs are your call here). Having said that, if you want to do it anyway, I would still only encourage you because that's what this is all about isn't it! I would none the less strongly recommend either upgrading to the later MK2 style shock mounting (also post 73 Mk1 if yours is already). Or you could fit turrets for a fraction of the effort of doing the whole 4 link thing. Either of these will allow you to fit a good shock at the rear which is hard to do with the standard setup, once again I would go Bilstein here. Or if you want, give MCA a call for something expensive and adjustable. Definitely fit a watts link or at least a panhard bar. And avoid tramp rods if you can (with the right leaf springs).
There is enough info in the suspension section of the forum that already covers spring rates, sway bar sizes etc. I guess my main point is to keep it reasonably simple, Given your application and the braking and ultimate grip limitations of 13's (I really like 13's too by the way, there are dynamic benefits of the much lighter wheel that offer advantages in some cases over bigger and grippier wheels) you just won't need anything too extreme and will be throwing away time and money instead of carving up the road in something that will pretty much be the best it can and needs to be anyway.
For my MK2 Track Car I went for the GAZ Gold Coilover set up as it is matched and designed to work together. They are a brand new casting and are thicker (62mm) than the Capri Struts too and also take the 2.5" springs. They are rebuild able too. I had a Capri Strut Coilover Set up that I sold for a similar price to these and have been very happy indeed. They are adjustable for bump and rebound too.
There are no doubt are better setups but for the money, they are fantastic.
Before I pull the trigger on a set of Gartrac front struts, can any one shed any light on the difference between 2.5" ID springs and 5.25" OD springs (aside from the obvious diameter)? Is there more choice available in one size? What are the different use cases for the different spring sizes?
The springs suggested are as follows: 5.25" OD 145lb 10" springs, will that be stiff enough for a fast road and hill climb car?
Finally, are the escort and capri wheel hubs interchangeable? Will my 1300XL wheel hubs fit on the capri style struts?
I think I might order the struts with 225lb 2.5" springs as a starting point and see how that goes. I'll add a set of Capri hubs to the order as well. Did the Capri's have the same stud pattern as the Escorts? Will my 13" ROH contessa's that are currently on the car fit on the new hubs? (Gartrac offer a GRP4 alloy hub) or are new wheels another expense ill have to explain to the wife?
Moving towards the rear of the car.
I got up early and went for a drive this morning. Around a sweeping left hander I noticed some new behaviour in the rear end. I had a look when I got home and the drivers side of the car is now sitting about 35-40mm lower than the passenger side at the rear (on level ground). I'm thinking one of the ancient Munro shocks has let go and it appears to have taken most of the rear spring eye bush with it.
The bushes were fine when I had the wheels aligned a fortnight ago.
As far as I can tell, the springs are standard, 50mm leaf springs.
In the short term, I need some new shocks, but I want to upgrade the springs as well. I've trawled the forums existing threads and I feel like a fairly safe bet are Bilstein units as I'm not going to go in the turreted direction.
I have a 73' Mk1 with the rear shocks on quite an angle. From reading the other discussions it sounds like the Mk2's had a more favourable angle on the rear shocks, and that some people opt to convert to the mk2 style. Is that correct? Whats required and is it worth it?
Would anyone have a part number for the Bilstein units for the Mk1? Is there a forum sponsor that deals in them?
All escort/capri hubs are the same stud pattern, just be careful on the stud diameter. Some hubs come without studs and its up to you to choose. The alloy hubs are also usually 10mm wider so of you've got guard clearance issues already be careful.
Shocks won't have anything to do with ride height. Check the bushes, if they're red they may have crumbled into oblivion. Superpro are a good replacement. Maybe a leaf has broken??
Mk2 rear springs will fit, mid eye on the front and reverse eye on the rear. You'll need to trim about 4mm off each side of the front rubber and the crush tube to fit.
Give Ken a call at Accurate Suspension Services, he can help with springs/shocks.